Pragmatic 30: Coffee

21 July, 2014


On the day following the launch of his new app Overcast, Marco Arment joins John to talk about coffee. We cover the history from the 13th century to present with brewing techniques and a bit about our personal journeys with that wonderful brown liquid.

Transcript available
Welcome to pragmatic pragmatic as a weekly discussion show, deploying practical application of technology exploring real-world trade-offs with great ideas transformed products and services change our lives nothing is as simple as it seems this episode is sponsored by many tricks and makers of helpful apps for the man as in many tricks or more information about their apps but Latino Leach Moon Usher which desktop curtain time sink and name angler if you visit that URL you can use the code pragmatic 25 in the shopping cart is a 25% on any management product this episode is also sponsored by life X visit life expelled LIF for more information and to take advantage of a special discount off their amazing LED Smart bulbs exclusively to pragmatic business wasn't animal during the show on the host on GG and today I'm joined by a special guest host to talk about somewhat of a more unusual topic at least offbeat for the show perhaps so I guess host tonight is a well-known iOS and web developer who in 2007 built the guts of a little website called tumbler are built an app to help him read his favourite webpages when I was on the subway when is our mobile data range called Insta paper then he did the magazine buckshot nursing clock on his blog his cupboard LED light bulbs headphones and bathroom layouts and sees had three big hot podcasts starting with build and analyse their neutral and now most recently the accidental jackpot cast and just yesterday he released a new app for podcast playback or podcast if you like that you may even be listening to this episode on right now it's called overcast so I am of course joined by none other than Marco arm is welcome to pragmatic marker thank you and hello and it's funny that we recycle out has very little to do with the insurer that you read for the show indeed but I thought about it and I thought well you know we are to 2 passions only this PHP and is coffee so had to pick one and so naturally we would have picked coffee and is Criswell wondering why not write it coffee is a pragmatic well coffee helps me to focus and to think is a stimulant so that kind works in I guess it is you use some technology to make the copied Gregory now arm the other that this is a very coveted process of heated water and some crushing of beans and in some storing those old capital price is absolutely absolutely so okay it's can be a bit different but you know what I am determined to tackle this the way I normally tackle topics so I had to start a little bit of history so history coffee a gastro-oesophageal I guess or turnoff but I turn off okay so in terms of recorded history going back to about the 13th century it was thought to have originated in what we now call Ethiopia so is believed to 1st been harvested are by Arabs in the 14th century the first actual document evidence came from Yemen in the 15th century so within a century of that it is spread all through the Middle East Persia Turkey and northern Africa within another century from then it was pretty much grown globally in a word coffee actually had English-language arm in the late 1500s arm and it came from the Dutch word arm well coffee KO FF i.e. but data that was also actually borrowed from a Turkish word and I'm not sure how to pronounce it in Turkish banana go with Carvey Mr KA HVE which in turn was borrowed from the Arabic and I'm leaving I try and pronounce that but anyway are injured know this even someone can pronounce anyway it was roughly translated as wind of the been apparently so that you can achieve that the word the word itself traces in the travel of the coffee from the Middle East through the rest of the world so the word sort of went evolved along with the beverages it was as it was becoming popular so the funny thing is that in in the Americas coffee came to the Caribbean and it was in the 1720s and that was actually pop it with anything it was popularised after the Boston tea party in seven 7773 during the American Revolution because drinking tea was a very British thing so drinking coffee yet was it that he was considering unpatriotic thing to be drinking so should be drinking coffee like freedom fries yet that's a yes exactly so they go drink your palm your patriotic coffee are one of the little arm darker sides of it just a sprinkle in here is that historically the cultivation of coffee sort of gone hand-in-hand unfortunately with slavery it sort of piggybacked a little bit on the sugar industry was never as big a driver as a sugar industry but the sugar industry and a can of coffee and tea industry is a sort of were all into interrelated and it was at its worst during the 15th and 19th centuries but sale is less of a problem these days but you still go read things from time to time about some places it's grown being perhaps some near less than less than ideal working conditions but in any case arm it's a very popular product so people are driver costs down anyway so there's two major kinds of coffee and is i.e. only learnt this very recently myself for reasons I'll explain later that anyway coffee are arabica and of course it is because it arabica and the other one is coffee a can of fora which is commonly referred to as robusta and those are two main strains and they provide between about 95% of the world's demand of coffee or production of coffee beans now because arabica you is one of those things that it's blitz I think it's less arm pest resistance or something like that it's it requires more care and attention and love or something is more expensive to produce but because it's much nicer flavour than there's 70% of demand is arabica robusta is about the remaining the remaining amount so it is used to usually blend together and sort of like size I hope percent arabica it'll be better wrap mostly rubbing of the robusta and that sort of thing and give a bit of a different blend anyway so it's a member of the group rib Ruby account God you know I'm illogical is now not a botanist it's a group rib Ruby act Either spell it asks are you BIA on earth is in the shadows thank you Michael yes Helga shows that one arm anyway it's from that that family gets its name arm basically it translates from the Latin word rib meaning read but of course you know by the time where you pick the berries and everything they end up being green and the money raised and this certainly not red or green anymore they get lovely shade of brown are so anyway but if anything I fight for either low I'd always thought that the coffee plant was a shrub but I only just learnt the other day that actually they come in as either shrubs or small trees depending upon are the type so are they can be either shrubs or small trees but they all produce blue-green fruit that we pick it we roasted grinder immersed in water chuck out the grounds and drink the water and we put like doesn't sound very young and doesn't sound very appetising restaurant correctly one-on-one appointment please read it as yet but the seeds that are in the fruit and about the price as being this greenish white if yellow colour examiner's year that's a blank yet regret this are the enterprise to eat but the different because God coffee cherry bra is red and it looks like cherries workers were probably white-collar fair enough and thank you for correctly and that because you can tell I haven't run my own actually have you okay fine while I've only ever seen it coming out of a packet and photos of it roasted so I'm my and your side have actually seen raw stuff before but I saw that the same bags of it on eBay and it was all green so anyway there we go so am I reckon the main reason that coffee is popular is because of caffeine and I don't know if that's even disputable or not because the caffeine out do you think people would actually enjoy drinking lots and lots of coffee do you think you know I mean there are a lot of people who drink decaf because fruit very freely they prefer it or they can have Cathy and Sabine have you ma'am but I would imagine most of those people probably used to drink regular yet and that's how they got Ian Attali got into copy and the problem I would imagine most UK drinkers you drink decaf because they like it but they started to like it because of the caffeine ours I think you know it's it's pretty similar to like non-alcoholic beer in that way in like Derek there are situations in which like in the social situations in which it most enough if you're if you're having a meeting or socialising a coffee shop and you can have Cathy and we don't want to have Cathy at that point is nice to have an option as our chaotic decaf you and you can still participate in the thing everyone else is doing arm without having the caffeine of the cause problems for you aren't by I have never had anybody who started drinking coffee because it was love the test alone men always drink decaf just didn't everyone caffeine at an ideal like coffee alight and so if I if if the Kim point where I couldn't have Cathy in anymore on a regular basis I would probably still drink it and is proficient decaf either as a little bit of a from the decathlete his work as we get to why that is but I but I think you're right overwrite I think the mean reason you're just like most people don't so drinking our God beer as I'll ever have phenolic them the reason might link you can appreciate beer as a complex beverage that he is good to you are but the mean reason multi-author drinking beer is because the alcohol rate and so hey I think I think the meeting really wouldn't coffee is for the caffeine and it just so happens that it is also a very good testing beverage that you can get into Canada as a result of wanting the caffeine absolutely at your eye and I like agree completely and I think that that's that's the problem is that the caffeine is where it starts so I think it's important that we discreetly cover I will be back caffeine because visible and invisible biochemistry and yes I apologise to build unlike the chemistry but the undesired habit so decide caffeine and have it in anyway so arm looking at that caffeine is or is is a stimulant and it is an addictive substance but the dependence on the withdrawal that you get is relatively mild compared to other drugs like opiates so the thing is the molecule itself fits into the brains and then addenda seen I think it's browse adenosine receptors and adenosine is actually responsible for towing the brain when it's time to sleep or to rest so the caffeine gets in there and blocks those receptors so that then allows a dopamine to work more efficiently and also triggers the adrenal glands to release more adrenaline so the combination of those things make you feel more alert we become more alert so with long-term use though the brain adds more adenosine receptors to compensate because the caffeine keeps blocking the ones that you've got and that because you develop a tolerance need to have more caffeine in order to then block the additional adenosine receptors in order to get the same result out the dopamine and the adrenaline so if you then miss your caffeine hit then the brain is flooded with adenosine and the dopamine adrenaline levels basically drop fruit through the floor and you start getting withdrawal so the thing with withdrawal is that the symptoms vary from person to person but the general ones withdrawal from caffeine headache sleepiness irritability lethargy constipation depression muscle pain muscle stiffness inability to focus or concentrate which is the big one insomnia and some people even get flulike symptoms so that all I know that's all but I guess what I'm curious have you over and I have you ever been through caffeine withdrawal was it like for you I guess so I never had anything very severe arm the only the only withdrawals in labour had our FIA if I go a day without having any coffee I will usually get moderate to mild headache at about 4 PM for a little while that's it and that is definitely a symptom caffeine withdrawal but I am actually have that much caffeine and I don't even though I love coffee alight or talking about and I made of severe copy gig I only have either one or 2 cups per day and a pretty small cups ardently to give you some idea the year each cup only has between eight and 12 g of coffee beans brewed with it so that your bike opportunities are pretty small cups and and and at most they will have two meet Simpson's only have one because iMacs are very sensitive to caffeine like that I can take if I have much more than that I get like to what's immediately caffeine overload worker Nunnally has become a tense and not as legitimate scanner high strung if I have to caffeine a actually filling a fever loudly unpleasant and can and so I have a one-sided hit those more severe withdrawal symptoms I think a lot of people get if the heavenly for a 5 cups a day and you start your okay wow well that that it's you match a surprise we market a thing as amount of mount time that I've I've heard you talk about coffee I was just jumped to that conclusion that you would therefore drink a lot of its arm I'm so glad you pointed out one hour because I've something I'd I had no idea and in my case I it sounds like I have too much coffee now got off your bad but some just sticking with withdrawal over the moment though i.e. I do have withdrawal from it and I find that the worst withdrawal from kicks in after 24 hours it takes about that long from the Mr filling symptoms and starts with its it's not a traditional hassle of a headache like I would get from you fatigue or maybe eyestrain but it is our it's a sort of a very dull very very light throbbing it's very distracting and then I outgrow after about halfway through that though the second day I do is get very very irritable I don't quite get the shakes but I just get very short with people and very snappy and I'm just generally not by our I'm not the bubbly pleasant effervescent personality are listening to right now let's put it that way so love to see you probably you this is bubbling what is that city look like I don't know I don't are there anyway so yet I do get withdrawal and yet sucks so I can I try to moderate my caffeine from two points of view one I want to be maximally alert and the other on a point of view as I'd I don't want to let go too long otherwise unknowingly get withdrawal symptoms and I'm not can be very pleasant so you so they go I guess I you I have issues but if I can make it past the third day that I'm fine and then I'll be without caffeine four weeks will be something like on title should have a cup and then I'm back in the training so you have found that leak its it's an easy tolerance to reset your arm in that like you know usually you if if you totally even if you have a lot lately you set something you do if you click called Turkey not have any caffeine usually leaked from a trip I think the matter of just one or two maybe three at most days image might see any problems at all and then you're totally reset and you can be knockabout to everyone you can stuff it forever and at that point it's it's a little easier to quit caffeine and it is like cigarettes now I assure you cigarettes are bad so it's like very hard equipment that it's either up there with opiates in terms of difficulty to tell you about the caffeine so okay so they gave now now if we both admitted that we saw tweaker caffeine levels are different levels but some members were stuck on the stuff that's okay because it copy taste lovely so that's all right all right here he goes the chemistry owns arm sat maximum how to pronounce some of these so there we go caffeine has a systematic name are 37 Di Hydro 137 trimethyl 1H purine 26 I own the submission of this are the salads yes it will are however the findings caffeine is also known as a 137 trimethyl explain and 137 trimethyl 26 dioxide appearing I mean obviously anyhow so has Aachen and was of a threat in caffeine is classified as an alkaloid and enters the bloodstream after an amount up to 10 minutes after it ingested our it's dust take effect and stays in the body for up to 12 hours obviously that rate varies from person to person some to people travellers are quicker than others but like other alkaloids note it has a psychological effects we sort of talk about but it stimulates the stimulation of causes the heart muscle to one month to be stimulating to be a bit faster relaxes other structures in the body and you including the coronary arteries in the and your lungs the wrong kind your lungs and the other benefit hour while side-effect is a diuretic which means what United diuretic as I know the result of a diuretic by but I think what it actually means is doesn't count because your body want to dump water that's exactly what it means very nice way of saying you gotta go and we a lot so yes basically and at that therefore dehydrate CNS that that's the downside so if you have a lot of caffeine and you don't balance that with a lot of water while the a lot of water but balance with water then you tend to get dehydrated obviously that's not good for you so anyway I guess before we go on any further horizontal benefit sponsor and that is that many tricks so matrix is a great software development company whose apps do well you guessed it many tricks their apps include Butler chemo Leach Moon Usher which desktop curtain time sink and name angler this so much to talk about each at what we can do is you focus a different one each week and this week we can talk about name angler now name angler's job is to rename files quickly efficiently and in huge numbers if you if need be considered replaced by pattern of course but you can extract meta data from the files you rename in use it in the file name had multiple steps to your renaming sequences you can run them one after the other you can create preset actions were commonly repeated renaming tasks and when you 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before 17 August you can take advantage of a special discount off their very helpful apps exclusively for pragmatic listeners simply use the coupon code pragmatic 25 the discount code box in the shopping cart to receive 25% off thank you to many tricks for sponsoring pragmatic okay so we talked a bit about the history of coffee and about caffeine but what I want to do now is to little bit about personal history and I like to start with you which is when did you start drinking coffee I actually didn't start until I had my first full-time job at the college and I was not one of the people that coffee and in high school or college a property should have but I didn't I feel it was really just you know I was adapting from a leader college kid to a Lizzie full-time worker and are needed in our little boost in the afternoon and in the mornings are as well are naturally how I got ago Sarah started out in a despite that the note I am better now I started outputting milk and sugar in my coffee and written telecopied from others big office copy parts and Yannon overtime is fully reduce the sugar in the milk though as a as they won't like the taste of it more manner they found that a copy is there and in a by probably three or four years enabled I was entering a black well I'm not that point yet so I not sure I think I will so as I'm seeing a progression already and it's only been exactly 2 1/2 three months and already stately sugar out so alright so all up so how long 1012 years would you say roughly been drinking then coffee at about 10 bats and so in my case I never drank coffee are I grew up in a relatively hot climate in the tropics and no my hometown of Rockhampton it would get up to go 40°C and sometimes quite yes quite warm one of it as an Fahrenheit that warm hundred hundred plus anyway so warm and is drinking a hot drink made no sense to me so I would I stick with cold water anyway i.e. ours started drinking Diet Coke and silent you gone to the gear caffeine through to Diet Coke however as I got older I know I started saving your issues with my teeth it's sort of started to because you had to many sodas soft drinks we can call them all soda pop our size anyway the enamel layer on your teeth and is not good and and up getting a few feelings and so on so is not good but I was still going on the caffeine I did not have hot drinks so are then there was an instance arm recently whereas I blogged about this on my website but if you don't and is the number of people that listen to the show that the don't read my site be unaware of this but I recently had a weight loss surgery because I had our I was having some health issues related to my weight and data in any case i.e. at now have got a gastric sleeve and I can't have soft drink anyone can't have bubbling beverages it causes intense pain and it's the sort of thing that's I have by basically have to remove my styli I flat my Diet Coke and drink it as a cordial which I don't like our or I found a different kind of beverage so I decided to try coffee and I never really tried it seriously in the past and if I had been a simple two and it had been that stuff that you describing you from the communal Job percolating yellow coffee pot machine that tasted absolutely horrid and is anyway I decided that I would try coffee and I have now been drinking it for just over 2 1/2 months getting close of the third month now and I've just for love and I think it's fantastic and is there I go get the caffeine and I'm looking for but I also am learning how to tweak the flavours the way that I would like them so for me as a very new thing very new sort of idea but you been doing this for me over a decade compared to me so are my need a lot more about it than I do so will discuss start picking your brain summers in the minute so I did a lot of research because it's funny how much I I just didn't know about how to make coffee because it was instant coffee which you your binder in a tin or a bottle and you put a couple of spoonfuls of into your hot water stir it and then you you think that's coffee and it's just terrible III can understand why people do it because it's so quick and so easy but I just could not get into it I will III mix it with the milk added sugar and is tasted odd to me is couldn't quite get into it so then I tried store bought coffee then there was Gloria Jean's and we do also have Starbucks yellow significantly less because Starbucks are doing well here so now now don't be mean but yes our site so and oddly enough it was Gloria Jean's store bought coffee that made me realise that coffee could actually taste better than instant coffee and that's what got me into it so I started researching my equipments and what equipment to use and is I guess I will get that in a few minutes but arm first of all talk about the roasting of that of the coffee itself now I have not roasted my own coffee so all I know is what I've read but as I understand it the different colours of roast light of this delightful way from light to dark and there is the first crack in the second crack I've read about but maybe it's more appropriate if you tell me a little bit more about what the levels of roasting and what gets you because you've done and I haven't yet so basically when you roast and and just to address that the periphery of how you roast arm in the big sharp doing his big machine these in a big steel drums in their usual ethical gas-fired site somewhere make tons of heat and if you hold roast in a year you have to find a way to keep beings up to roughly 400°F whatever that is Australiana it's a right arm is a roughly 400°F it is as we're going to affect the exact number four for the different cracks but you can run a Wikipedia if you look at everything they have an email message and as picture grew out of the different levels and what colour it looks like a nice anyway so arm will be that assurance of one of its members yet it's in our solar homework machines look basically like if you receive monitors home chicken rotisserie machines and it was a large toaster oven basically that's what most interest to look like some of them look like tiny sharp rosters arm that the one a start off with is it's got to be more BHM or arm it's one was Pablo once it's the one I would recommend if it if you want a copy resting was at the one to get arm it's about 300 hours in the US I don't know if the available day in other places but but 300 bucks in the US both litigated is a website called Sweet Maria is as sweet Maria is not calm and they also supply our unregistered means by which is very nice than they have a lot of tutorials on how to roasting their videos and everything so if you want your time roasting got slippery as an instructor are you giving into it much much more cheaply with either a cast iron skillet or a park or an air pipe and they can if you can get one frolic 30 bucks planned attic and there's even though this forum is people like figure in which models of our partners work best for this purpose and how you can mind yours to build hey it's the little community people who wrote it with our puppet but arm weird in fact friend of friend of the unit_David Smith started out that way and I think sunblock still does it that way I'm not sure why arm but the deed and I'm pretty sure both of them have at one time refusing our partners in fine arm anyway so these machines are in a basically toaster oven is that with drums and it spent and an biggest have in Nancy output incidents of acute distinct so hot within about 15 to 20 minutes arm so when you roasting are you that the beans come as these really like horrid Reichart it it's like it if you try to buy into entertainment into uncooked popcorn kernel are in the rockhard little beans arm and either looks the RPL green to pale yellow and did not mean you roast them as the roast the counterpart like popcorn arm the havoc this outer skin on them that false icon chaff and donates it as it just makes a little like witless flakes of justice, dust dusty being in it if you open the copy me if you open the roster and sneeze local everywhere to be careful that I ordered a vacuum nearby when you roasting obviously chat about bladder anyway so as you roast in the car park and at first crack our first crack is them reaching the point where the chaff blows off the path to get that Lawley cracked part in the middle of the Binbrook bridal theme runs through arm that cannot cracks open and that's that at the first point in its pits pretty far into the process in if you doing a roast that's 20 minutes long first crack will happen around 50 minutes gets it pretty foreign most the process is pretty boring arm and then between first and second crack is when you got all the doctors I was at first crack is like the earliest you can stop the roast and have it be drinkable in any reasonable way because it if you miss that if you started your early the coffee you get tests really wearily because unrested being don't smell a coffee needle the lesson I can of grassy it's like I always like Mickey was not in my house because strengths are and there I was surprised by by leave it Holly's Italy was unwilling there is not of the expected copy business knowledge because they're not my copy arm if you start the roast before first crack your coffee teeth like that are that's not good it's it's a very hard unpleasant taste that you don't generally want arm anyway so first crack the very light brown but now the DB certainly drinkable and you progress and really over the course of 3 to 5 minutes you progress through the entire the entire reintroduction levels and you can choose to start the roast whenever you want arm and so you choose how Dr roast arm and there is a science lesson there as there are some tricks you can do with lake in with a pleading with the heat level during that time were turning on a raft Fanta to exhaust the hot air from the roster at different speeds and junior trainer like trying to get the colder roast curvature different the different progression of the heat into the billions I have tried tweaking that here and there and have never found the results noticeable in the way roast it's probably not a very skilled rooster but whatever the reason that that has other with a complexity to me so I just let it go full blast until it reaches Minnesota's level and I started arm so as it progresses ill it will arm if you have coffee and at a fancy place like some town in the US or in a newly fancier graph roughly 4 of the last few years it will never get close second crack are they stuck the roast very early unusually like the author of the way between first crack at second crack so it's it's still pretty late flavour I like it better dark and so dark but not like number at and how iced up at the falsity roast which is why may be the corporate entity that that is that a do my my blog and podcast business whether Scott falsity of service of White Hart as a corporate interim analyses the Manhattan workers can have an unreasonable meaning of falsity but are but it's more about coffee and and so a so falsity roasting is a temporary magnetron check Wikipedia but it's it's right before or right at second crack rather as you roasting the first crack is like this loud puppet sounds of popcorn in the roster is very very clear and then it ends a lot like my Korean popcorn PC like United Icahn comes in a wheelie bin part alliance might you know firstly I want you and your whole light and an milk and a drop-down ganglionic water to the review took a while in and then second crack sounds almost like Grace crispies crackling it's it's our innovative it's a much quieter more elite crackly power sound and again the same thing you have to like you hear a couple of them early in your/hearing more and more frequent wines there be an obvious peak was whether altered in second crack and start feeding off arm from me I liked Ali to stop the roast rate at legal right is a/hearing the first few of them heading second crack advanced up the hepatic crack burns pretty quickly and and so you that's that that can what roasting is like hunger and and that the process and that other beings and one more big warning if you are interested in getting into home roasting roasting coffee proves a lot of smoke and steam smoke and so do outside of something or have a habit of extraction fan you a lot of people do outside API for I did my first couple of roasts arm more put the roaster on a big tree on top of my my range and use the rings fan arm that was not sufficient and wireless arrangement sucks and as African artists bite but part of it is that it neither lights are what you now as I have the roaster I cannot type that has a window above it and a paperbacks fan on a windowsill blowing out well Mike arm so it's an attic care of everything box and put a light area below so that I do in our livelihoods do outside the delivery do it if you can read over and empower outsiders that delivered there was a best seller track you down Marco's was go look for the year the steady smoke are: write your roasting will notice you you can smell it from a few houses away I now have very nice neighbours idea while the fellow copy maybe an offer of some sago okay call and also if there is any question in your mind about whether you should roast the answer is no you shouldn't add yet and yet you do write it of course it will it is like writing your own blog platform you shouldn't do that either but I do like you generally if if you're looking at Ripley prattle step when you connect you can try to cost argument use a well you a really great unrested coffee bean might be six or seven dollars a pound and applicability of the average closer to 56 arm and so that's really that it it cheap unwritten coffee is cheap and you can get really good coffee that would if you if you bite copy that was that good from someone roasted in maybe 20 bucks a pound you can get that first of December so there is a big cost savings but you have to pay for the roaster and so it I think it's a prolonged economic cost argument it allows you to cross that line bite is mostly about control because the event of home roasting is that a because the unrested means keep relics six months a year so I have a cabinet full of unrested being they have like £20 I arm and so then I'm never out of coffee whenever I whenever I am running on beings I give her some more and so any point I can have fresh fruit to be that in a lot of places you there is no local fresh roster that a lot of these are the only cough you can get is all copies and store shelves for six months arm or in warehouses for six months arm and lighter places even pleas that have fresh roster is nearby which are pretty rare usually usually if you can see the roaster in the story the property aren't fresh roster you bode are you even pleas that I roaster sometimes the war roaster you like sometimes the roast too dark to light and so it's a way to get exactly what you want whenever you want are and are pretty much infinite supply of, of copy done exactly away that being said it is a hassle arm it is something that takes time in a row start to finish possibly the time to have our and so we know it's not for everyone by by by a long way is not for everyone so the other thing that I was told is that once you do roaster beings you've got about two weeks something arm before you ask you arm what fancy this is one of the reasons why store what coffee is bad yeah arm big highs once you roast coffee it is kind of like fresh produce in that link when it when it's in with the dried unrested state it's pretty stable for a lot and once you've roasted though positive chemical reactions inside of machines utterly qualified as a result of what they are alone has without sedation oxidisation division oxidatively one has to do with that and regattas given to be in the be in the internal camera genuinely roasted basically arm the short version is you have roughly a week after roasting words really good and then and so after roasting it it starts losing flavour some people argue that the best flavour is actually deed to referee afterwards visits on the gas telescope at the roasting for a while but I was whether it is action as the reason why the bags have little one-way area valves on them yet it's to let it it's to let area that comes inside out because the beans will continue to emit carbon dioxide for a little while after the roasted so that's what all those other to get to let air out arm but so you know the best flavour is between EOD zero intuitive and who you ask and are and then as as the beans get stale their flavour started dropping and the flivver gets enough ladder are looking awesome at some of the high notes are lost in otitis greatly results and issue or a local wine district well you but you write is analogous to you now losing the details you asked and you start losing you the user losing leak that the final part of the flavour the the more savoury parts you just you will live it over and over about a week maybe two weeks and then what after about two weeks the beans reach liquor a stable relatively stable like flatness where there are no longer greet but there okay and they can stay in that state for long time months are so almost any bean you get from a store is in that state because just just the supply chain just takes whatever it takes more than two weeks chant as I whenever Carthusian store shop is been roasted a least a month ago probably more arm and so the trick the people use so in a generally speaking the difference in flavour between fresh and not fresh is the nut fresh leverages dull its flatterers let its less compared with less bald there is less is less flivver there in general and it's kind of a lower quality flivver but is a trick if you roaster really dark really dark then you can get more flivver out of it's not a good flivver instead test chart almost it's more flair are so super dark roasts are a way for all beings to seem to be no to relatively undiscerning test to seem like that link there are more board and have more flivver for a longer period of time never the wailing Trader Joe's sling. Is this very publishing here in the US of grocery stores that sell this deviously selling all the weird food privately bald so that's been sitting around for a long time and some of its good live at night carbon carriages it's it's like if you've forgotten what is gift baskets has acknowledged the thick brands of like crackers and stuff in them linking of holy is energy that is a lot like those gift baskets where everything is is privately bald about 1/4 of it is good and the rest of it is forgettable or bad and are and so in its roasting coffee really be held as a super dark roast in his tubs and proper as a year ago in own and her and our and that but that's that's a willing to super darkness is a way to to make the coffee have more flivver for a longer even if it is necessarily a good flivver and is also Starbucks district by the way exactly start I suspect yet that's it so I guess from this are and thank you for all the detail because I read bits and pieces and the bits and pieces I'd read about the level of roasting was that the dark you roast it is especially starts to destroy the caffeine it you get less acidity arm there is more oil that leaches out of it but the flavour ceases to be about the flavour of the actual coffee beans themselves and more about the flavour from the roasting process of the gas is a way that I I took it to mean you. Use the term roast flivver run that euphemism for Shari Brent flivver Fry said okay that's that's what that means really arm and you so inner as you know it's it's like it's like toasting anything you like as you you to appoint earlier unwary relic in either the inherent flavour of the beer is still there but wanted starts burning even a little bit the branch lubricant can take over the flavour profile very ugly because during your Brent food such a strong flivver yet that housing are yet to be very very careful with it fair enough right call well are it's just time for our second sponsor so little of it quickly about life acts that spelt LIF X and is a smart lightbulb that gives you previously unheard of control of your lighting each lot each lightbulb is Wi-Fi enabled can give you light whatever colour of the rainbow you like and it's an energy efficient LED light publishing control with your smart phone with over thousand lumens in disposal it's incredibly bright but it consumes 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need to explain what you mean by O God because I am I've picked a bad thing to say but okay so okay so when when coffee beans are freshly roasted dimensionally but the error about the one where a valve bags because they still continue to have a lot of carbon outside and in the gets emitted slowly when you pour water on them they gets emitted quickly and I note you I'm sure it is a good chemistry reason why I don't I am not qualified to explain why that happens so when you when you brew very fresh coffee beans are the former because all the air in them escapes quickly and mixes most big for me had and on the coffee arm that you're just a pouring beer to 1st and if you copies more than about six days from roasting that won't happen nearly as much if at all I already know it to a level you will notice arm but yet for the first few days it's pretty noticeable and can't come and bring wisdom these days is especially due to the poor over bar or an error press where you are you are controlling the water flowing into the beans arm the common wisdom is too poor just a bit of water at first and then wait for the coffee to blue in the blue really refers to the forming up of notes of the air coming out of exerciseable like for me had that made even the globe and in part because you can support somewhere publicly speaking a soufflé so are the common wisdom is that you should let this book is important little bit let it bloom and this does something and it's vague as to what people think is does the act think the most comforting people think it is a somehow improve the flivver arm amazing you don't RES here and I think in its coffee you can brew coffee in a lot of different ways all you're doing is adding water to the beans in some fashion are providing maybe some kind of agitation method whether it's storing or whatever and then straining at the ground somehow that's all you're doing and so there is lots of different ways to do that are in a lot of different things you can do any step there to 22 in a try to add your own flare or try to make small changes that you think might make a big difference I think a lot of this is placebo here so there's all this is passable variation in how you brew things and there's a lot of room for arm what most people call ritual are and anything that a good word for it and most of the sugar it yarn because ritual is something that you do because you do it and it's not necessarily because it does anything arm you might think it does something are but that's an often not supported by science reason arm and I think that a lot of adding in coffee brewing the light of like well you do this way because I was in it seemed like it might make a difference or omits its fancy and it gives you a gives you a feeling of being fancy arm ill reasons like that the problem with that is is that it makes copy seem flashier than it really is it makes you know it makes people who don't care at the ritual after they have two weeks time doing certain things to do things certain worthless communion very horrid cleanup arena various has various practical deficiency his and doubts of bloom is one of the many things are I put a foot wedding with paper filters in the same category here arm some people say that you should whet or rinse a paper filter before use it because it will make it is less like paper arm I think if you if you copy testing. And way too much paper and not enough, I've never had a copy they could identify as having it. He stated that his psychological so anyway arm and especially with an error press well it that the filter is in a relative of the divine liquid and the volume of copy with that the filter is such a tiny mass it's this then. Little this denotes the adding adding a scrap around a I've never saw the light is things I will do things certain way that the that the web that the pros recommended do it that way for a while and I want to wonder what happens in Vegas do this the easier way cannot try it in a couple to sell the same manner so thirdly get on okay Argus only to man and there is there's a lot of things in coffee and I think everyone should can find your own preferences there are like in a people see you to do at Swayze but you try it both ways and can tell a difference don't like struggle to tried to trade difference that isn't therefore you are me know if you can tell just do it easier for you Catholic you are a I do with the error present in the inverted method brew pack and had subaltern upsidedown use of the public up I do because it actually easier for me to do it arm it either it is not as crazy as it sounds our world actually easier because I can control the amount of water because into it very easily without having to wear a megawatt beforehand arm I could have a cattle full of water that I boil on and I pour in as much a need for you to fill up basically and anyway though at the school be elected in general arm it's important for people to realise that a lot of the things you read about how you need to do certain things with the coffee and everything else in life are a lot of things that people seek to do you should figure out for yourself or the ones that eliminate a better light of the middle need to do yet and in my researching this there are so many opinions on the best way to brew coffee it's a sort of got to that point broke I stopped reading them because it got it was impossible to gather all conflicting and somewhat say different periods of time blooming thing for example yea somewhat sale to waste time other people say the AF absolute you gotta do it sends the answer I tried it and is I couldn't detect any difference so I don't bother I simply I put in our right and I guess this is the next step ISO racing to talk about is specifically how we go about bringing some started this already so we will talk about roasting on a row studies by a gale admit I am IIR 202 things I have the I'm in a dam hurrying to get out the door and I have the arm I want a nice as nice a cuppa coffee as I can make and I got time to make it so I I buy have arm and I I know that you roll your eyes at this but here we go cost free ground coffee arm and ready to go into 10 and the one in a hurry to get out the door and I've got's are a couple of being arm couple my sale holdings admit that they are dark medium to dark roasted are one of them is our Vittoria coffee which I note that you have a North America bitsy ace one of the sort of chain brands here they also have far coffee café's and so on around a lot to serve the Vittoria coffee and I got some some stuff from actual from freshly roasted our local specialty coffee roasting placement you're talking about and I'm almost the bottom of that bag I believe it's sad about that so because they push really nice so I have a hand grinder and which is so because I I looked in the cost of getting an electric one and I also know how loud they can be so I actually went with a hand grinder it's a heart Harry O's curtain I think it's pronounced our haters as 1B hand grinder and it takes about man ethics ref are you taking a five minutes to grind enough for hey it's therapeutically settler keep telling myself like your late-night sisters reservoirs to Bob to disappoint you just ahead yes are about about how loud they can be yet that is correct however there are two types of grinders that most people have arm there is the spinning bleed or the law of the conical brew grant arm the spinning bleed as the key players what everyone everyone assumes before it is literally a spinning bleed at the bottom of the small club and it spins ridiculously quickly and it can beat the blizzard beat the beans in the submergence arm and the fancier kind is the brother grinder which it it crushes the being between two spinning rough steel birds busily arm and and so we are rather than stroking them into size it crushes them into size are the advantage of this design the number of managers to it that the main advantages arm that the grain size can be more consistent and this is important for things like go French press where if you have a bunch of big chunks for the French press and a bunch of small chunks that happening it in there because you could run it was sloppy arm then in a French press like this masterfully go out and you'll have that slide among the cup that that there and and so the brother grinder can get a much better consistency of the grades are perfect but it is better arm and a colossal greenlight finer usually arm but the other advantage that may be relevant he was at the quiet now there is not quite like absolute and there are still loud devices like I've heard it's it's a much lower pitched sound and it's in at lower volume than a spinning bleed grinder arm stood still loud boat but much more pleasant I think and not as loud for the biggest problem I face is that I get up to go to work at five in the morning and I can't be grinding and making any noise and I even thought the handwrite only quite enough until I was really nice and it was it was loud enough that my son came out it was 5:15 in the morning and he said daddy why you grinding it it's too early in one sorry so that was that arm not I actually have a hand rented for travel purposes echo and I hit I would never recommend a hand rented anybody is fitted with it is such a ridiculous amount of time and effort to grind one cups with coffee by as it is completely not worth it I shall the speed you can control how fast you grinding that might affect the flavour though I would rather do is bring some teabags may travel next to switch to T for the week because it's easier than trying to grind your own copy would hand. We know what hey maybe one of our graduates one of these fan dangled you know machine things but half for the moment I cable and and thought it was worth you can get a good brother grinder a I anime trade lower that the law in ones but there is some fully 50 or 60 bikes are and that a reasonable arm and then the one I recommend if you if you want something really good for them for the long haul I recommend the Barossa virtuoso is about 200 bucks and are it's a nice heavy piece of machinery that like it you use a sling and you can tell this is gonna last and you like it doesn't move into the button that is heavy and just at the grain size is nice that the bleed is a very advanced like it is take apart and clean if you need to are it's it's a fantastic survey so you Barossa virtuoso 200 bucks at the medical if you can if you Are what spend 200 button a copy grinder that is totally understandable are and wikis I suggest either you have a spinning bleed Peter Yuri have our level has one of those and if you don't as apparently we have one there is any morning did you get to get here to restore and buy one for a dollar arm there everywhere and achieve it even buy them new frolic 10 bucks in Munich these are no expensive devices or if you want to snap adopted Osman 200 bucks spend 60 bucks I got a decent programmer you can phone store that's it arm kill you so don't never ever get a hand grinder under any circumstances they never work that you will hit it and the whole category should go away I am sticking with my story that it's therapeutic and that's just fine okay so I think it's a good point to keep moving so we can move onto a fresh press great French press versus Aero press and I think you've already kind of alluded to the fact that your mom than a repressed guy and I'll put my hand up and say so my and it's the grit because i.e. our user French press once and is there was as discrete in the bottom and it was not this ascites I hate that grit you I just I don't like that having that in my mouth at the end of an Aryan race negative Lassiter French press, our largest diet but now that there the Aero press is just perfect I believe I can see why Ron Reyes about but the thing that Aero press I wonder quiz you about with your thoughts on any sort start on this topic was the paper versus there is there is a very arm is a stainless steel insert you can use instead of the paper that's supposed to be fine enough that it stops all the grit from getting through but they people live in men saying I been reading are because the paper leaches all the oil out and that's a bad thing because the oils flavour and you therefore that's bad so first question is do use the pay of the paperless stainless steel disc arm and why I guess or do you think that oil thing is is BS as well so I've tried to steal stillbirths that the koala difficulty reasonably with rhenium to think while ring in the company name some with that but you call the Glover desk arm now and it is called the desk whether analyses the Theology as filter expectorant extra and is now sold separately arm the as filter is by far the better one by a long shot I did a whole review of it on my side and with closet pictures of the difference in everything and so on top of that but arm it if you fear so the Theology as filter of its Value were cared arm but in my review of that I I'd say I took pictures because that the oil in coffee usually will flow to that half of the cup and you can see it in freshly brewed coffee that has any oil in it you can see this all Sheena little oil dart falling on the type of of the coffee arm so it is very apparent one of their I took closet pictures with a macro lens and a couple of flashes to eliminate this are of 2 cups brewed soba side of the same means with two error presses one with the Reality as filter the metal filter and one with the people to come with it and they both had oil on top they both look exactly the same annotated in both and it is exactly the same and so I think you are a favourite others accenting everyone thinks that people felt as block oil and not sure that's true arm people to do block some things that that the Miller filters.are one of them if you look there is and how to find the link there is an interview with a year ago with the guy who invented the Aero press were things in Alan Adler maybe some something Amber anyway arm that look this up but they asked him again what he thinks some of these things people do with it and and he mentioned something that is interesting that one of the oils are one of the chemical compounds in coffee arm can actually increase your LDL cholesterol which is bad you are ego in editing it increase your cholesterol in a bad way arm it's it's is possibly smile amount per cup but this one can of the compound in coffee can do that the people filters block it Miller filters.the views of people filter you are not drinking the compound and so there is actually a health benefit even though it might be minor to using a paper filter to me though so why do the sub is a test I could not tell a test difference at all Russell that advantage is removed there is a slight environmental argument to be made for another in well if people filters after one use the arm but you used to make a metal filter and I'll be at an the amount of people that you use only a repressed filter is so small arm I would imagine the difference in and people are of course the biodegradable everything and usually comes from trees that run civilly for that purpose arm so I would guess that the environmental argument there is not that strong in the metaphor the property doesn't matter head-on in the long run a little bit but I bet it's a pretty weak argument arm the other argument against the metal though as comedians because if you have an L filter that means that after every brew you have to take the tick the butt Of the Aero press and instead of just pumping the whole park in the garbage I go in elect a reasonable human being shown and having almost no clinical to do it all you have to do feel that yet appeal at metal are filter off the coffee grounds which is in the heart it's very inconvenient to remove this and you have to rinse it after washers and dryers and put about and so it totally changes the community everything is something people try to make the Aero press less convenient because I think it is better that whatever is convenient and it did sleep the edges it seemed like one of those things that people do because someone said it make a difference and in reality it IIA in my opinion it doesn't are you can try try try back to back brew to cover the same time are one with one without city debt you can tell difference I cant and so I can recommend this filter is it just seems like the make everything harder arm for not much reason the the one benefit they have that I can see is is real is that you can run out of metal filters the right are you so you are in the near press comes with 350 filters are and you can get community more for about four dollars on Emma's own whenever you want arm or any coffee retailer so their oppressors will usually so little to steal and the outside for about 300 of them so you if you if you if you go on a trip or something and you don't want to bring people to read only limited atheroma filter in the back to you that's the only real argument I have four and Latin America argument I have two different metal filters and areas I never bring them anywhere I just never argued spring will stack people filters in concert with Sana can because it when you're travelling it's a convenient thing is that because you want to do cleaning up and drying when you're out about so even talking about leaking a bring in the press to a hotel in the untimely brown demands hours of gone there for the delegates link bring it to a time when people do that arm not a lot of your but some people do that I have done that I tried it edges has never been worth the hassle so I ate it this way you spring teabags or trader coffee wherever I am that's reasonable and seedy stalking Starbucks at any time not Starbucks disc set out in our biology over the matter, find a structure copy roster and see what a fine and usually A Realist Abuse I Find Something Decent Analytical Area That's It It's No Big Deal Fair Enough Soba with ER with the Stainless Steel Filters Though Do You Find That They Do Ashley Stop All and All the Grit Orders of Summer It Gets through with Those Oil a Pretty Good Arm Then They Mostly Do Men and It Part of the Problem That I Have the with the Disc Filter the Eligibility the Koala Disc Filter out Is That the Halls on It Were Big Enough That the Grind Could Actually Climb Them up and That Snug Theology As Filter Does Not Have a Problem It's It Has an Extremely Fine Mesh Arm That the Coffee Grounds As an MOU to Give a Copy and Not Able to Clog up Arm and the Koala Disc and Are There for Multiple Versions Please Email Me Are Either Way Yemenite's Lodge Was Not a Problem with Coffee Grounds Getting through Them Was Not a Problem Are Immoral to Grant a Study by the Way This Is One of the Reasons Why You Grinder Yes the Aero Press That the Flavour You Get from It Can Improve Substantially If You Meet the Grind Fine Yes Arm You Should Be Using of a Grind Almost As Fine As Espresso Break If You Have If You Have One of the Brighter Grinders Arm Are Usually the Hell It Was Big Dial That Can Go from 0 to 40 and I Usually Put My on Six Right to Give You Some Idea Locale Finds Grinders Yes Arm Were Bigger the Larger Numbers Are Bigger Right Side Is Almost As Fine As It Goes down Mom Either at My Hand Brighter Is It Has Several Clicks on It so Selector for the Conical Arm Because the Conical Bohan Grinder and That You Are It's Basically the First Click Open That's Our Fine It Yes and Which with a Handmade Immensity Where Long Yes Much More Effort I've Noticed That Yes My Upper Arm Strength Is Improved Dramatically Recently for No Reason I Can Think of Any Rights Cool so As to Quickly Talk Now about Arm Steeping Time and Is the Things about Some Experiment with a Little Bit and I Honestly Am Not Sure What the Right Answer Is and You Probably Got a Better Idea Than Me so How Long Do You Let It Set You Said You Do the Aero Press and the Inverted Method How Long Do You Actually Let the Hot Water Sets Arm Just Immersed in the Grind Semester Hot Water before You Are Inverted Press It Not Very Long Arm Usually Less Than a Minute about Catherine Literally One Minute Would Be That Would Be the High-End Arm and and You Can Use Their Present Beginning of the Oppressors Are to That Let You Plunge Coffee at the Bottom of It When You're Done I Arm It Set and so You Can Use It like a French Press A Lot Of People Do Wear a French Press Typically Has a Four-Minute Brew Time ACE Is a Nice Big Range of Pre-Large Chunks of Ground Coffee and Their and Four-Minute Brew Terminal at Them Slowly Step Arm I Don't like French/French Press Flivver Enough to Do That Arm by the Way If You Are Using a French Press and You Have Never Use the Erebus Let Me Tell You How You Clean Aero Press This Surface Will Sell You Yes It so in a French Press Is Horrible in Error Press Is after You Push the Coffee out to the Bottom of It Are the Grounds Are Compressed into a Little Park That Said You Take the Cap off Your Order over the Trashcan and You Hit the Back of It like I Was As If You Had a Glass Catch a Bottle Dedicated to Follow-Up Hit the Back of It Firmly in the Park Just Pass out the Garbage Can and You Have an Almost Perfectly Clean Aero Press Usually Rinse It a Little Bit and As It That's It and That Was It You Don't Then and If You Want to Make a 2nd Cup You Can Immediately Start at Slightly Where Friend Called RN Zoning Is Outlet You Can Immediately Do the 2nd Cup If You Want to Arm the Downside Is That You Can Print Limit Want Upper Time Are You Can If You Tribally Hiding Admit to Decent Cups but As for Most Women Want a Better Time Arm Anyway so You Can Use America's Aufranc Press Reuse Are Very Large Grind in Your Sleep for a While before You before You Plunge out Arm I Don't Do That I Think the Whole Point of an Error Press Is to Get a Flavour That You Cant Really Get from Other Methods Arm It's It's a More Dense Strong Flivver Not As Strong As Espresso Boat Partially Partly Is the Part Where There between Your Coffee and Espresso Arm and so It's It's an Extra Bald Flivver and Strongly Rely Find Very Pleasant and Clearly the Market Agrees to the Press Does Very Well Beast Is the Arm and so Together Flivver Unity Is Very Fine-Grained When Using a Very Fine-Grained Your New Line Distraction Times Because You Certainly Can a Trainer Brew at the Flivver from This Grinders Itself so Fine It Doesn't Take Long for That for That for the Flivver to Go into Solution at That Point Arm so I've Read A Few Articles That Say That If You Actually Leave It into Long or Does Increase the Acidity to a Point Which It Gets Its Less Less Pleasant Flavour It Does Increase the Bitterness Because like the Different Compounds in the Been Linked Legal Dissolution at Different Times like at a Different Directions of Being What the First Thing B Is Caffeine Are Exactly How Decaf Works We Get That You Want but Arm Differently If You Put These on What the Caffeine Liaison Was Immediately Arm so That That the Brew Time Doesn't Really Affect the Caffeine Level Arm but Some of the More Bitter Compounds Leave the BN Last and so the Longer You Leave It in the More Likely It Is That It Might Become to Better Ourselves Now Acid Is a Different Type of Catholics Acidity Arm Is Widely Thrown around I Think It Means Different Things like You Simply Lick It It Could Mean like the Science Version of an Asset Versus Bears on the PX Scale Are It Could Mean That Most People When Popular Acid in Food Are Talking about like Stomach Acid Which Are Always Correlated to Whether It's a Matter Appears in the PX Yelling and It Is Not That That's a Different Thing and This Is Why I Haven't Done A Lot Of Research into This with Coffee Because I Have Had Problems with Acid Bite Arm I Think A Lot Of People Are Taken Advantage of by Marketing Claims of Acid Being Higher or Lower Lesser More with Certain Being in Certain Brewers Arm Because the People Need That You Copy Your Teacher Stomach Get Heartburn Arm or in a Because of the Problem Free You My Trailer at Brew Our Boat Are Not Actually Sure Helps Are a Favourite Things That That's a Boat with Some People Say It Helps A Lot Something They Read Say It Makes No Difference Arm and the Ones That Sentimental Difference Are Usually from More Credible Sources Who Would Know Things like This like Medical Journals Must Sell Their Own Incline Am Inclined to Think That the Acid Level Is Mostly BS or Air At Least It Doesn't It Doesn't Do What You Hope It Does Witches Make It Easier on Your Stomach RTF Has Loretta Level Instead I Go Call so Right so I Just Start There A Few More Things to Talk about Almost Done Her This Funny Thing Is It's Didactic Quite a Bit Too If You Go into the Details so Okay Arm It's Cup A Few Times Let's Just Briefly Touch on Why Decaf Tastes Worse I Think You Arm Dated Earlier so You Go for It yet so That That the Many Reasons That His Worst Economic Arm so Here's the Thing with Decaf There's A Few Different Methods to Get the Caffeine of the Beans It Is No Separate Planter Anything It's Thrown Out Of the Ground, with One Arm It's the Same Coffee Beans They Have Cathy When They Start and Exit the Process to Remove the Caffeine and If You Wish to Do It Check Wikipedia Little Explain in Detail Arm the Quick Version Is Arm Usually the They Are Immersed in Some Kind of Chemical Solvent or Just What Arm before They're Arrested and so Is Immature Caffeine Goes into Solution First and so Arm There Is Either like This in the Chemicals You Could Amend That That the Catholic Is out but the Whole Idea Is You Want to Try to Remove the Caffeine in without Removing the Other Flivver in the Bin Because You're Kind of Bring It so You Want to Leave the Other Flivver's Improvement Caffeine As You Can This Is Our Present Process and the Different Methods of Doing It Have Different Techniques of Your Track Trying to Do This Properly or Well the Memes so See You Have Used to from the Decaf Number One Is That the Decapitation Process Just by Its Nature Will Remove Some of the Flivver and Some of the Good Parts Arm to the Beans Usually Aren't As As Fully Flavoured the Other Problem Is the Decaf Process Costs Money to Do and so You Know If You Are a Coffee Vendor or a Coffee in Our Supplier You Have Two Choices You Can Either Charge More for Decaf Beans Which Is What Good Good Suppliers Likes the Specialty Nerd Suppliers They Do the Caffeine Should Be More Expensive Because There Has Been an Extra Step Performed on Them Are There If There Are There Are More Responsive to Produce but in the Marketplace like You Know You Had a Starbucks Are Diner or Something and If You Are a Charitable Micro Decaf and Icon like That Very Much and so What Most but Most People Do Instead Are It Is You Scrap Your Beans Flat with a Pentecostal Ass and That That Cut the Cost Savings and the Beams Can Offset the Cost of the Process and so the Reason Why Decaf Beans Taste Bad Is Usually Because There Were Speeds That Are Quite Robust or Something Right and Is Also a Practical Issue above If You Are If You Are a Coffee Shop or Something in Your Selling Multiple Different Brewers the Specialty Single Origin Other Stuff Arm Usually the Demand for Decaf Is Far Less Then a Regular and If You're Especially Pleased with That and so You Might Only Have Justification to Start One Decaf Bean Tape It Will Properly Have To Be a Bland Soil in All Villainous People and Everyone Even Sells Much of It so Your DB As Fresh in Our Because You Will Have Much Turnover on Them so That All These Different Practical Reasons Why a Lacuna in Reality Decaf Usually Test Worse Some of It Has To Do with the Process but I Think Most of It Doesn't Cool Well I Am Gonna Try My Hardest to Never Have Decaf… A Really Good Reasons I Have Tried It so I Couldn't Tell You but I'd I Trust and Believe That It Tastes Terrible so Will Will Run with That It Usually Isn't Terrible Usually Is Incredibly Forgettable It Doesn't Have A Lot Of Personality As It Is in Either More Flat Average Unremarkable Flivver Because the Christian It Is Not Is Not Using Green Beans in a Group Where There Are Usually Very Fresh Cool Okay so the Last Thing I Decided to about Really Quickly Though Is Some I Guess This Is My My Journey Which Has Been Nowhere near As Sale of the Duration of Yours but My My Coffee Journey Where I Am at the Moment How It's Changing in Three Months Is I Basically Will Make Myself a Last Day so I'll Do the Espresso Base Is in Era Press and I like It to Be Are You Quite Quite Strong and Then Mix in Undiluted with You Some Milk Which I Recently Got Myself a Four Offer Which As Well As Onesies If You Pushed out Too Much Is It Yes I Know Last Night and Easiest Laugh It up One Cleaner Are What Are My Wife's Safety That Sounds That Seems like an Awful Lot of Trouble She Says She's Wrap It Yes Is Right Anyway so Was Roasting Yourself You Know I Can't Really Argue Well the Go so Were Both Crazy for Different Reasons Eager Anyhow so I Then I'll I'll I Don't like to Start out with Some Else Equal Splendour Cold Stansted Via Stevia Whatever You Fake Sugar Not Real Sugar and I Put That in There and I Put in Some Are Some Kind of Flavour of Some Kind like a like a Caramel Cerebral Sling like That and That Would Be What I Would Have Because It Gives You Realises Where I Started so I Started with That Was What I Would Get from Gloria Jean's and I Want to Replicate That at Home and I've Come to the Point Where Now I'm Actually Reducing the Ratio of Milk Sites Are Going to a Stronger Flavour Some Saying Used to Be More like Wants to 5 Now down to One Is to 3 Maybe Even Half and Half to the Point at Which I'm Now Going to Be the Opening Less and Less Milk in Given up Putting the Sweetener in at All and It's Just List the Syrup so I'm Can Foresee a Time in the Not-Too-Distant Future Where I'm Going to Probably End up Going the Syrup Panel and I'm Just Having the Coffee As My Taste Is Changing and Eats It so Fascinating the Way of Things I've Noticed Though Is That the Flavour of the Coffee Changes from the First Sip Although the Final Set and I've Gotta Get a Thermos Mug That I Keep It in to Try and Keep As Warm As Possible so Is Not about the Temperature of the That the Drink and It's Got Somebody with the River Yum the Taste Receptors on Your Tongue Being Told Either Based on Either High-Temperature Initially All You Owe the Bitterness Not Entirely Sure Which It Is That Something That You've Noticed or I'll Definitely Usually the First Use of the Best Yummy That Some Party You May Also Be Seeing Part of the 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I'm Writing Is Only As Awesome at It's Better It's It's Compared to Other Apps out There like Castro and I Downcast I Find It Very Nicely, Nice Compromise Aptly Gives You It's a Beautiful Nice Simple Interface but the Same Time Is Still Quite Powerful Invisible Features in Their like a Smart Speed I Really Really Enjoy Outcome Depend on so It Only Came out Yesterday Says for A Lot Of the Press It Is Free to Download and so There Is an Inner Purchase to Unlock Some of the Extra Features but You Can Sample Them for Periods of Time to See If That If There Are What You Want and Honestly for What You Get for That Price with a Free It's It's Fantastic I Think You Should Check It out and the Banks of the Western Coffee to Death That Marker You so Arm If You Want to Talk to More about This You Can Reach Me on Twitter at John GG Does JH NCH ID GUI and Check out My Writing Attack If You'd like to Send Any Feedback and Are You May Have Some of Our Coffee Who Knows Please Use the Feedback Form on the Website and That's We Also Find the Shadows. Set of the Pod Casts Pragmatic He Also Followed Pragmatic Show on Twitter Decision Announcement and Other Related Materials I'd Also like to Thank Our Sponsors for This Episode Are Festival Metrics for Laura If You're Looking for Somatic Software That Can Do Metrics Remember Specifically Visit This URL Many Tricks or One for More Information about Their Amazingly Useful Apps and Use a Discount Discount Code Pragmatic 25 to 25% of the Total Price of Your Order Hurry It Is Only for a Limited Time and I'd Also like to Thank Life Extra Sponsoring a Show If You're Looking for a Great LED Light Bulb Is Energy-Efficient Remotely Controllable Colourful and Just Plain Fun to Use Remember Specifically to Visit This URL Life Expelled LIF and Use the Coupon Code Pragmatic of 50% off the Total Price of Your Order Dislikes a Very Special Thank You Also to Marco for Joining Me on the Show and You Took Me Quite a Bit I Did Not Know and Dispel A Lot Of Our Myths about Coffee so Thank You Very Much for Coming on and If People Do Need to Get in Touch with You and I Still Don't Know How to Get in Touch with You How Would They Do That Are Best Places to Use Twitter and a Requirement and I Already Got a Market or Applying for Any of This Information and Want to Spend Hours Reading Really Geeky Stuff That Property If They so Marco and the Face Listening Everyone Eliciting a Thing Marco I However Talk about Overcast Little about Software or Something and I Know That Everywhere Else Yeah Exactly I Can Do Copy My Show Because Neither of Them Drink Coffee�
Duration 1 hour, 41 minutes and 31 seconds Direct Download
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Show Notes

Caffeine systematic name: 3,7-dihydro-1,3,7-trimethyl-1H-purine-2,6-dione; aka 1,3,7-trimethylxanthine aka 1,3,7-trimethyl-2,6-dioxopurine

Check out his new podcast playing app Overcast site and the [App Store Link] as well as my review.

Some Useful Links:

Marcos Coffee Equipment & Recomendations:

Johns Coffee Equipment:

The Tweets That Started This Episode:

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Marco Arment

Marco Arment

Marco writes at his site and has a podcast with friends called the Accidental Tech Podcast each week.

John Chidgey

John Chidgey

John is an Electrical, Instrumentation and Control Systems Engineer, software developer, podcaster, vocal actor and runs TechDistortion and the Engineered Network. John is a Chartered Professional Engineer in both Electrical Engineering and Information, Telecommunications and Electronics Engineering (ITEE) and a semi-regular conference speaker.

John has produced and appeared on many podcasts including Pragmatic and Causality and is available for hire for Vocal Acting or advertising. He has experience and interest in HMI Design, Alarm Management, Cyber-security and Root Cause Analysis.

You can find him on the Fediverse and on Twitter.